Keep In Mind...

[MrB]

Not sure where you guys are getting this info

Based on everything I've read...all of the intangibles Cleary favor Wentz

I don't think anyone is debating that. If Wentz had Cal written on the side of his helmet instead of a Bison there's no doubt everyone would be saying he's the clear cut best player in the draft.

 

[cmd34]

I don't think anyone is debating that. If Wentz had Cal written on the side of his helmet instead of a Bison there's no doubt everyone would be saying he's the clear cut best player in the draft.

Nope.

Wentz is really good. Goff is better.

 

[MrB]

Nope.

Wentz is really good. Goff is better.

Well most of everyone would think so.

 

[onlyonenow]

You have to remember that Manning wasn't even really Manning at that time. He had a rep coming out of college that he had all the intangibles (and tangibles) he just couldn't win the big game. He was kind of thought of as a choker (especially by the people that hated Tennessee). People thought he would end up being like his dad, a career or great numbers but no rings. They were obviously all wrong but that was the theory on him at the time from what I remember.

From what I remember about Ryan Leaf, he looked the part. He was big, strong arm, athletic, and was exciting to watch. I believe he was a little bit younger than Manning too. He didn't have all the intangibles that Manning had like the leadership qualities but people thought he had a higher ceiling. Plus he was much more mobile and athletic than Manning. Like you said though, there were red flags. There are always coaches though that thing they can coach the bad habits out of them and teach them to be leaders.

Unfortunately for the Chargers Leaf's immaturity and stupidity far outweighed their coaching abilities.

yeah the idiots that talked about Archie not being a winner are the same type of morons that blame all the Boys losses on Romo. A QB with the abilities and skills from a combination of Joe Montana/ Steve Young/ Peyton Manning could not have made the Saints winners back then. IF a team could have a worse rep then the Browns have now the Saints from inception till the 80's did.

You look at those back then that thought Leaf was better and you will find some real idiots there.

 

[onlyonenow]

Not sure where you guys are getting this info

Based on everything I've read...all of the intangibles Cleary favor Wentz

need to look closer at Goff. He has been shown to spend more time in the film room, has to be chased off the practice field, etc then Wentz. Leadership seems about even; something I would give Goff the edge is that NDS has been a top team in their area for a long time; Goff has had to deal with a team that certainly has had good years but nowhere near that kind of tradition. And add to that the fact that as regards competition Goff has certainly faced much better. AND on top of that Wentz is used to having quality (as regards the division they play in) around him while Goff has not. ITs been tougher for Goff and that to me has made him tougher then Wentz who frankly has had it easy.

Wentz came from what could be called the Alabama of that league and competition level. Obviously superior to the teams they usually face. Coaching, tradition, talent, etc. ALl too often QBs that come from those situations do not do well when forced to adjust to being on bad teams.

 

[onlyonenow]

Just like RGIII didn't Mirer win ROY? Or at least Co-ROY? Mirer's fall was due more to his inability to adapt once defenses figured him out.

Smith/Rodgers was a big debate too before their draft. Still not sure what caused Rodgers to fall so far.

If I remember right there were some vague rumors about Rodgers that in the end were completely false that came out just days before the draft; really vague and did not get any media play but apparently the good ol boys network in the NFL spread them all over.

Mirer to me is a guy who could have had a good career in a very specific system. His first year showed that; I think he could have been a Smith equivalent; but never got lucky enough to get in a place that worked for him.

 

[MrB]

need to look closer at Goff. He has been shown to spend more time in the film room, has to be chased off the practice field, etc then Wentz. Leadership seems about even; something I would give Goff the edge is that NDS has been a top team in their area for a long time; Goff has had to deal with a team that certainly has had good years but nowhere near that kind of tradition. And add to that the fact that as regards competition Goff has certainly faced much better. AND on top of that Wentz is used to having quality (as regards the division they play in) around him while Goff has not. ITs been tougher for Goff and that to me has made him tougher then Wentz who frankly has had it easy.

Wentz has won more than Goff. That's not all on Goff but it does play a factor when trying to determine who to take first.

 

[onlyonenow]

Wentz has won more than Goff. That's not all on Goff but it does play a factor when trying to determine who to take first.

only idiots do not consider the team around a QB when looking at the record.

 

[MrB]

only idiots do not consider the team around a QB when looking at the record.

I agree, but there are a ton of idiots in the NFL

 

[ThoughtExperiment]

Not sure where you guys are getting this info

Based on everything I've read...all of the intangibles Cleary favor Wentz

And by "you guys" you mean onlyone...

 

[onlyonenow]

I agree, but there are a ton of idiots in the NFL

you are being MUCH too kind. At least 10 tons (especially the fat asses like Ryan)

 

[dbair1967]

Nope.

Wentz is really good. Goff is better.

Nope

 

[dbair1967]

need to look closer at Goff. He has been shown to spend more time in the film room, has to be chased off the practice field, etc then .

Make up shit much?

Haven't read that anywhere or anyone who talks about him mention anything like that.

 

[onlyonenow]

Make up shit much?

Haven't read that anywhere or anyone who talks about him mention anything like that.

1) you have not looked because you fear anything that threatens your man love for wentz
2) EVEN IF YOU SAW IT YOU WOULD REJECT IT since you want to live in a fantasy world
3) Goff was handed the job his freshman year and by his sophomore year his TEAM MATES voted him captain
4) Wentz sat behind WHO for two years?

 

[dbair1967]

1) you have not looked because you fear anything that threatens your man love for wentz
2) EVEN IF YOU SAW IT YOU WOULD REJECT IT since you want to live in a fantasy world
3) Goff was handed the job his freshman year and by his sophomore year his TEAM MATES voted him captain
4) Wentz sat behind WHO for two years?

Sure I've looked. I've seen nothing that disputes either guy has any work ethic or intangible problem. Its been cited by many of these people that both guys have all the intangibles and work ethic teams want.

I wouldn't reject it if it were true, again there's been nothing to suggest either guy has an issue with this.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make with 3 & 4

 

[MrB]

4) Wentz sat behind WHO for two years?

Wasn't the guy that was in front of Wentz an upper class man that won like 3 National Titles?

 

[onlyonenow]

Wasn't the guy that was in front of Wentz an upper class man that won like 3 National Titles?

and where is that great player NOW?

 

[onlyonenow]

Sure I've looked. I've seen nothing that disputes either guy has any work ethic or intangible problem. Its been cited by many of these people that both guys have all the intangibles and work ethic teams want.

I wouldn't reject it if it were true, again there's been nothing to suggest either guy has an issue with this.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make with 3 & 4

of course not= if you had to think about it you would start to doubt your man love

3) was wentz voted Captain by his team mates?
4) this great player that wentz was unable to beat out- where is he now and what is he doing? Obviously NOT in the NFL. So if Wentz could not beat him out....

 

[dbair1967]

of course not= if you had to think about it you would start to doubt your man love

3) was wentz voted Captain by his team mates?
4) this great player that wentz was unable to beat out- where is he now and what is he doing? Obviously NOT in the NFL. So if Wentz could not beat him out....

Wasn't aware Wentz wasn't a captain. I know Connor Cook wasn't, are you confusing the two?

#4 is a ****** reason dude. There could be about 100 reasons for that. All that matters is what he is now.

 

[dbair1967]

of course not= if you had to think about it you would start to doubt your man love

3) was wentz voted Captain by his team mates?

Apparently so:

2016 Senior Bowl
* 2015, 2016 NCAA Division I Championship Game Most Outstanding Player
* 2014 College Sporting News Fab 50 All-America
* 2014 College Sporting News FCS Playoff MVP
* 2014, 2015 All-MVFC Honorable Mention
* 2015 MVFC Offensive Player of the Week
* 2015 NCAA Elite 90 Award
* 2013, 2014 NCAA Elite 89 Award
* 2015 CoSIDA Academic All-American of the Year
* 2014, 2015 CoSIDA Academic All-America First Team
* 2014, 2015 CoSIDA Academic All-District
* 2014, 2015 MVFC All-Academic First Team
* 2012, 2013 MVFC Commissioner's Academic Excellence Award
* 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014 MVFC Honor Roll

Two-year team captain for the 2014 and 2015 NCAA Division I FCS national champions...Went 20-3 as a starter...Missed eight games his senior year with a broken wrist but came back to start the national championship game...First North Dakota native to quarterback the Bison to a national championship...As a first-year starter, rallied the Bison out of a 14-0 deficit in the season-opening win at Iowa State and orchestrated two late game-winning drives in the playoffs...Intelligent player who poses a dual threat to opposing defenses with good speed and a strong arm...Finished third in NDSU history for career passing attempts (612), completions (392), yards (5115), touchdowns (45), completion percentage (.641) and pass efficiency rating (153.9)...Also fifth in NDSU history with 6,143 yards of total offense