Bob Sacamano
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Separation of church and state, bros.
- Thread starter skidadl
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skidadl
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Which is not required for private gatherings.
skidadl
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I don't really care if the guy was being a dick, having satanist meetings, having orgies, swinger parties or whatever. That's not the point. It is about freedom.
Keep focusing on your hatred and going away from freedom. That seems like a great idea.
lol @ freedom
This guy wants to build a church on his property, has alienated his neighbors who are now using the law this idiot Christian thinks he is above in order to cause him problems.
It has nothing to do with freedom this guy is an asshole and got what he deserved.
This guy wants to build a church on his property, has alienated his neighbors who are now using the law this idiot Christian thinks he is above in order to cause him problems.
It has nothing to do with freedom this guy is an asshole and got what he deserved.
ps change Christian to Muslim and Church to Mosque in this story and see how the idiot Conservo-Christian media runs with it then.
They can't build a mosque in that neighborhood it's only 1500 miles away from ground zero! Show some respect!
They can't build a mosque in that neighborhood it's only 1500 miles away from ground zero! Show some respect!
skidadl
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Fact #1 - he does not have a church on his property
Fact #2 - Alienating your neighbors is not illegal
Fact #3 - Being an asshole is not illegal
It would seem that any person with good common sense would simply ask themselves if this was a church or should be zoned commercial. Answer those questions and you have the answer. All of this other stuff you are throwing out there makes no difference.
Fact #2 - Alienating your neighbors is not illegal
Fact #3 - Being an asshole is not illegal
It would seem that any person with good common sense would simply ask themselves if this was a church or should be zoned commercial. Answer those questions and you have the answer. All of this other stuff you are throwing out there makes no difference.
skidadl
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Right. They could make a ton of noise, campaign, file some lawsuits and all of that. But nobody is going to jail for having Muslim worship in their house.
You quite obviously didn't read the long article about this man and are just shooting your mouth off in a zealous Christian rage for no reason. All the stuff that "makes no difference" makes all the difference in the world. He ABSOLUTELY is operating a church in a building that isn't up to code or coded for that use. Claiming he isn't shows your ignorance. You posted this - FFS research it a little bit. After Salman got busted for his little 'I have a building permit" lie (thou shalt not bear false witness?) he applied to build a "game room" which he is now using as a church, for his Church, which is incorporated (yippee! They even have a sign on the gate for Harvest Christian Community Church, but it's just a little bible study, right? Right.).
We have codes for a reason, and one of those reasons is so that churches and mosques and strip clubs can't just set up in residential neighborhoods and start annoying the piss out of everyone. These people think they are above the codes/law, as is evidenced by their lying multiple times to city officials and carrying on with their plans regardless of orders to stop. They have no respect for the law or their neighbors and absolutely deserve none in return. This would be shameful conduct for anyone, even more embarassing that it's some "devout Christians" lying and trying to skirt the law.
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Whoa, whoa, whoa...woooooooooooooooooooe. I can't build a strip club in my backyard?!?! Is this fucking Russia?
Typical Strip-Club persecution.
You might remember that the ancient prophet, Leisure Suit Larry, foretold this sort of persecution when he said "If the world hates you know that it hated me first. But you are no part of the world so the world hates you. If they have persecuted me, they will persecute you also. For a slave is not greater than his Master, is he?"
This is all just fulfilled prophecy.
skidadl
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I know you don't know me that well, so it's all good. The thing is, I have a pretty long history (in real life and on the internet) of being fair minded when it comes matters like this. I've been accused of being a little flaky by some of my Christian brothers because I strongly believe in freedom. So you are mistaking the words that I am typing as some sort of rage or something. That's OK though, I'm assuming that you expect this since there are many idiots that rage in the name of God. I try to keep that to a minimum these days.
So like I said, all we need to know is if this is a commercial usage issue. That's really all we are talking about here. If he lied before, broke some commandments, built a building without a proper permit (you obviously know very little about how this works in the real world) and all of that, it makes no difference. None at all.
It's a lot like smoking weed. They can't arrest you because you look like a pothead and people think you might be stoned. You could get pulled over with a roll of sandwich baggies, some fresh pipes from the head shop, rolling papers and a t-shirt with a maryjane leaf on it. They could be sure that you had weed somewhere but they still have to follow procedure to arrest you. If they ask you if you smoke weed or have it at your house you can simply say no and you are fully protected until you actually get caught for a crime. If you have some weed in your house you are still protected by laws. A cop would have to have the right to search your home and follow the proper procedures in order to arrest you. After that you would still have a right to get representation for yourself and use every ounce of the law to get out of it.
It's the same here. This guy says he isn't operating a church, so it needs to be proven otherwise.
So like I said, all we need to know is if this is a commercial usage issue. That's really all we are talking about here. If he lied before, broke some commandments, built a building without a proper permit (you obviously know very little about how this works in the real world) and all of that, it makes no difference. None at all.
It's a lot like smoking weed. They can't arrest you because you look like a pothead and people think you might be stoned. You could get pulled over with a roll of sandwich baggies, some fresh pipes from the head shop, rolling papers and a t-shirt with a maryjane leaf on it. They could be sure that you had weed somewhere but they still have to follow procedure to arrest you. If they ask you if you smoke weed or have it at your house you can simply say no and you are fully protected until you actually get caught for a crime. If you have some weed in your house you are still protected by laws. A cop would have to have the right to search your home and follow the proper procedures in order to arrest you. After that you would still have a right to get representation for yourself and use every ounce of the law to get out of it.
It's the same here. This guy says he isn't operating a church, so it needs to be proven otherwise.
Yeah you're right it's only like....idk....my fucking job. Get a clue. You've taken absolutely no time to educate yourself on this, you got caught up in your fox news/email chain/conservative-christian media rage fest (despite protests to the contrary) and quite simply, you got sucked.
You see if you had bothered to research anything at all about this case, or shown any ability to think for yourself before crying faith persecution, you would know that his church (the one he has meeting in his "game room" every week) is a registered 501(c) Harvest Christian Fellowship Community Church. There are even all sorts of sites set up where you can donate to their registered nonprofit Church Organization (yippee no taxes!). It's the same church that got too big for his previous dwelling, before he merged with another church (the one that eventually kicked him out). You'd also know that the Church's address is listed officially (surprise!) as Salman's home address.
But you didn't bother to do any of that. If you had you wouldn't have bothered posting this idiotic article.
But don't take my word for it ask one of your Christian brothers. Preferably one that doesn't try to lie and skirt zoning codes because he thinks his ministry is above the law.
http://news4themasses.wordpress.com...or-preaching-but-for-failing-to-obey-the-law/
skidadl
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Wow, easy there buddy. I do not watch Fox News or vote Republican. You are getting a little ahead of yourself. I am a licensed General Contractor so I thought I knew a little there but you clearly trumped me. I don't participate in christian idiot media either. Like I said, you are really assuming a lot here and like to generalize who a person is. That gets into the realm of bigotry. Just relax a little and use your mind on this one, ese.
For some reason you are turning this into a religious persecution thread. I never did that. It seems that you projected rather than read.
lol, come on bro. All I did was post the article. I DID NOT research it at all. I even said that back in the thread. You sound like a really amazing wizard that MUST research all of the articles before you post them or comment on them. lol, did you research the article before you commented or did the discussion spur you on to read up more? Don't let pride catch you in a lie here, lol. Nobody would think that you research articles before you post them. That just sounds stupid.
I gotcha, you are mad because Christians lie.
Thanks for the link. I'm going to read it an form an opinion I apologize in advance for not researching it before I commented here.
By the way, did you bother to research this article before you posted it? Did you research the author? lol, oh man, I laughed so hard because I could just imagine you feeling all accomplished and self righteous because you really busted me on the whole thing.
lol, guilty as charged, your honor!
I know. Do better next time.
The second this article was posted and peeps in the thread started crying he should be allowed to have bible study bbqs alarm bells went off that the whole story wasn't being told because if it was the city was acting illegally. So I dug deeper, as you probably should have done. Between news articles detailing this idiot's fight with the city and his neighbors going back four years it was obvious that the "Pastor" was in the wrong here. Doing the same yourself may have saved you the embarassment of declaring that this was a "freedom" issue, rather than an "I'm an asshole-entitled-Christian who flaunts the law and expects to not answer for it" issue.
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skidadl
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This guy should go to jail for publishing this website:
http://web.archive.org/web/20010802132421/http://www.harvestchristianfellowshipaz.org/
It's horrible.
http://web.archive.org/web/20010802132421/http://www.harvestchristianfellowshipaz.org/
It's horrible.
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Sheik
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I clicked on the "times and place" link.