School Superintendent Cheats, Lies, and Steals for big $$$.

[2233boys]

Because you aren't comparing apples to apples

 

[JBond]

233...How would you suggest to fix the broken system? For instance in Kansas City, which lost it's accreditation and had to be taken over by the state again, the same people are still recycling the same failed ideas expecting different results. The one decent Superintendent they had was run out of town for actually addressing the issues.

Why are unions and tenure necessary to teach kids how to read and write?

 

[2233boys]

In pa for example I think school districts should be county wide that would save millions per school district. Unions and tenure aren't necessarily the problem it is the poltics behind it. I also think that without certain protection teachers can't effectively do their jobs. Imagine a teacher being threatened that they'd lose their job if certain students didn't get passing grades even though they didn't earn the passing grade. I also think school should be year round in every state. I also don't think the entire system is broken. European and Asian countries don't educate all students like we do. The kids that don't have the ability for academic school work are phased out and put in vocational schools. Even our students who have gone to votech are held to the same academic standards as the traditional education students. It isn't comparing apples to apples.

In the US, we have to educate everyone. No child left behind needs repealed. It is unrealistic and creates teaching to a test which is no way of educating a student. Critical thinking, challenging courses, smaller classrooms, all need to be on the table and that costs money. If you are just going to bitch about teachers pay (which isnt out if line) then we can end this discussion now. Keep asking questions though it is easier to explain a position if you know where the other side is coming from.

 

[dbair1967]

No I said all teachers aren't like that. You tried to indicate the where by posting a story about other corrupt teachers. The And post was my way of letting you know that didn't refute my original statement.

That's two school public districts very close to each other, it certainly doesn't mean ALL are like that. But I strongly suspect we can easily find many similar examples.

 

[JBond]

In pa for example I think school districts should be county wide that would save millions per school district. Unions and tenure aren't necessarily the problem it is the poltics behind it. I also think that without certain protection teachers can't effectively do their jobs. Imagine a teacher being threatened that they'd lose their job if certain students didn't get passing grades even though they didn't earn the passing grade. I also think school should be year round in every state. I also don't think the entire system is broken. European and Asian countries don't educate all students like we do. The kids that don't have the ability for academic school work are phased out and put in vocational schools. Even our students who have gone to votech are held to the same academic standards as the traditional education students. It isn't comparing apples to apples.

In the US, we have to educate everyone. No child left behind needs repealed. It is unrealistic and creates teaching to a test which is no way of educating a student. Critical thinking, challenging courses, smaller classrooms, all need to be on the table and that costs money. If you are just going to bitch about teachers pay (which isnt out if line) then we can end this discussion now. Keep asking questions though it is easier to explain a position if you know where the other side is coming from.

I had serious concerns about "No Child Left Behind" when I discovered one of the main sponsors was Ted Kennedy. Not that he was a dem (I applaud Bush for trying to reach out) but because he was completely unqualified. Teaching to the test is something teachers have chosen to do. The test is not very difficult. The minimum score requirement should be achievable. It may be flawed but there does need to be some way to measure success. I am sure you have some ideas on the topic. Happy to hear them.

The problem with the school system as a whole is with those that run the thing. I am a big believer in studying a topic and finding out what works. There is no reason the Kansas City School district (one of the worst in the country) cannot look across the state line and see why the Shawnee Mission district is so successful and try to implement some of the successful ideas. The school board is the issue in KC and it will never change because most citizens have no idea when the election for the board is even held (which is their fault, but is true none the less) and most people don't care.

The system in KC is rigged and the kids will continue pay the price. The Superintendent that was run off wanted to consolidate schools because the district has gone from 60,000 students to 20,000 during the last 20 years but no adjustments had been made. He was a strong proponent of vocational schools and also wanted to expand charter schools. Since he upset the financial apple cart, he was fired.

A NY times article about the Super they fired.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/31/us/31missouri.html?_r=0

 

[2233boys]

It isn't that test isn't difficult but all kids have to meet the same standard. So the kids who'd have no problem with the test do well sure, but the kids with no parental support or just don't care are held to the same standards. The teachers are forced to teach to a test to get the slower kids to the minimum level. Soon every student needs to be proficient and that is just impossible.


I totally agree with you on school boards. Those who run do so because they have an axe to grind all to often.

 

[2233boys]

Charter schools as a whole aren't run very well in my opinion, cyber charter schools are the worst.

 

[JBond]

It isn't that test isn't difficult but all kids have to meet the same standard. So the kids who'd have no problem with the test do well sure, but the kids with no parental support or just don't care are held to the same standards. The teachers are forced to teach to a test to get the slower kids to the minimum level. Soon every student needs to be proficient and that is just impossible.


I totally agree with you on school boards. Those who run do so because they have an axe to grind all to often.

You just touched on a very sensitive issue that deserves discussion but most will shy from.

 

[2233boys]

Which one or both?

 

[JBond]

the kids with no parental support or just don't care

This in particular. My ideas on the topic will not be popular with those that are left of center. Faith and family are a large part of the solution in my humble opinion. Something that is ridiculed and not hip these days. Reducing dependency on the government and teaching self reliance is frowned upon in many segments of society. It has become a generational problem. It was not that long ago I was among the poorest of the poor, so I believe I am able to see it from both sides. The failure of parents and the avoidance of responsibility for their actions especially among young males is particularly disturbing.

See, we can have a conversation without me being a dick. : )

 

[jeebus]

In pa for example I think school districts should be county wide that would save millions per school district. Unions and tenure aren't necessarily the problem it is the poltics behind it. I also think that without certain protection teachers can't effectively do their jobs. Imagine a teacher being threatened that they'd lose their job if certain students didn't get passing grades even though they didn't earn the passing grade. I also think school should be year round in every state. I also don't think the entire system is broken. European and Asian countries don't educate all students like we do. The kids that don't have the ability for academic school work are phased out and put in vocational schools. Even our students who have gone to votech are held to the same academic standards as the traditional education students. It isn't comparing apples to apples.

In the US, we have to educate everyone. No child left behind needs repealed. It is unrealistic and creates teaching to a test which is no way of educating a student. Critical thinking, challenging courses, smaller classrooms, all need to be on the table and that costs money. If you are just going to bitch about teachers pay (which isnt out if line) then we can end this discussion now. Keep asking questions though it is easier to explain a position if you know where the other side is coming from.

It's $15,000 a student a year. Already. They dont need more money. Create the ideal school system in your mind, then pay for it with $15,000 a student and I guarantee you you have money left over. The problem is over 50% of the money is spent outside of the schools in central administration.

I know you think you would cut that down with county wide school districts, but I would bet 2 to 1 that you would double it with that move. School districts almost need to be one school wide with some roving supervision.

 

[2233boys]

It's $15,000 a student a year. Already. They dont need more money. Create the ideal school system in your mind, then pay for it with $15,000 a student and I guarantee you you have money left over. The problem is over 50% of the money is spent outside of the schools in central administration.

I know you think you would cut that down with county wide school districts, but I would bet 2 to 1 that you would double it with that move. School districts almost need to be one school wide with some roving supervision.

No you wouldn't.

 

[superpunk]

Don't ask for jeebus' breakdown on what it costs to build/run a school. He spends like 25k per acre on land.

 

[NoDak]

25k per acre? Holy crap, Jeebus. Where did you find such a bargain?

http://www.landandfarm.com/search/ND/Williston-land-for-sale/

 

[superpunk]

You know that land is more expensive in places where people actually want to live, right?

 

[NoDak]

lol

You've told me before that nobody would want to live in North Dakota. Now you change that to land is more expensive here because people want to live here? So which is it?