superpunk

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,003
Reaction score
0
The most respected investor and capitalist on the planet, Warren Buffett, took to the pages of the New York Times this morning to bust a myth that has dominated political discourse in recent months:
The idea that raising taxes on super-rich people would hurt the economy.
Buffett observes that his own personal taxes as a percent of his income have plummeted in the past decade, to all-time lows. He observes, as he has before, that he pays a much lower tax rate than his secretary. He calls out the absurdity of hedge-fund managers and other professional investors playing "long-term capital gains" rates on short-term trading profits.
And then he takes aim at the biggest rationale for preserving these astonishing tax breaks: The claim that, if taxes on deca-millionaire and billionaires were increased, these super-rich Americans would stop investing, thus clobbering the economy and hurting job growth:
Back in the 1980s and 1990s, tax rates for the rich were far higher, and my percentage rate was in the middle of the pack. According to a theory I sometimes hear, I should have thrown a fit and refused to invest because of the elevated tax rates on capital gains and dividends.
I didn't refuse, nor did others. I have worked with investors for 60 years and I have yet to see anyone — not even when capital gains rates were 39.9 percent in 1976-77 — shy away from a sensible investment because of the tax rate on the potential gain. People invest to make money, and potential taxes have never scared them off. And to those who argue that higher rates hurt job creation, I would note that a net of nearly 40 million jobs were added between 1980 and 2000. You know what's happened since then: lower tax rates and far lower job creation.
When presented with these facts, those who argue against tax increases on the super-rich--or, even more absurdly, for more tax cuts--often point to President Ronald Reagan, observing that he cut taxes for the wealthy, helping usher in a long economic boom.
This ignores the point that Reagan also raised taxes. And more importantly, it ignores how high tax rates on super-rich people were when Reagan cut them: In 1980, the top bracket was a startling 70%. It also ignores how Bill Clinton raised taxes and then took the US from the perpetual deficits of the Reagan years to a surplus. It ignores how George Bush cut taxes, plunged the budget back into a deficit, encouraged the wild borrowing spree that inflated the housing bubble, and then oversaw the worst recession since the Depression. It ignores how the US prospered all through the 1950s and 1960s, when marginal tax rates were super-high. And so on.
In short, it ignores almost all the economic data we have. And it appears to be based on a rigid ideology, rather than common sense.
Buffett, by the way, isn't proposing a blanket increase on today's entire top tax bracket, those making over $379,150, many of whom protest against the idea that they are "rich." Buffett is suggesting the implementation of two new brackets--one for taxpayers making over $1 million, of whom there are 237,000 in the country, and one for taxpayers making over $10 million, of whom there are only 8,000.
In other words, Buffett's tax-increase-on-the-super-rich would affect 1 in 1,253 Americans, less than 1/10th of 1% of the population.
Do you really think that would clobber the economy?
 

Plymkr

2
Messages
2,126
Reaction score
0
How about stop sending billions to countries that can't stand us. ?

How about reforming or abolishing welfare and all of the entitlement programs?

How about doing something about ILLEGAL immigration instead of putting a fucking bandaid on it for votes. ?
 
Messages
2,064
Reaction score
0
Nothing is stopping him from writing the government an enormous check. Maybe he should put his money where his mouth is...and I'm not just talking about contributing to campaigns.
 

superpunk

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,003
Reaction score
0
How about reforming or abolishing welfare and all of the entitlement programs?

Doesn't make up enough of our national expense to really matter tbh.

It's also a necessary thing, however it does need reform. For example, I have two neighbors - one is an elderly couple who could really use assistance from the government. The husband is seriously disabled and gets disability from the government, but it's not enough. His elderly wife works six days a week so they can make ends meet, but they can't get any welfare money from the govt. OTOH, another neighbor is a bumass woman with a few kids who is completely paid for by the state, she has absolutely no intentions of working or lifting a finger to support herself or her children.

We need these programs, we just need to find ways to administer them better.
 

Plymkr

2
Messages
2,126
Reaction score
0
Doesn't make up enough of our national expense to really matter tbh.

It's also a necessary thing, however it does need reform. For example, I have two neighbors - one is an elderly couple who could really use assistance from the government. The husband is seriously disabled and gets disability from the government, but it's not enough. His elderly wife works six days a week so they can make ends meet, but they can't get any welfare money from the govt. OTOH, another neighbor is a bumass woman with a few kids who is completely paid for by the state, she has absolutely no intentions of working or lifting a finger to support herself or her children.

We need these programs, we just need to find ways to administer them better.

All for giving my tax money to the elderly and vets. I am talking about the folks who abuse the system.
 
Messages
46,859
Reaction score
5
I'm all for offing the elderly.

They really serve no purpose, and just slow everyone else off.

Plus, the money their heirs would get from their life insurance would help boost the economy.
 

superpunk

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,003
Reaction score
0
All for giving my tax money to the elderly and vets. I am talking about the folks who abuse the system.

And who is going to be the decider of who is worthy and who is not?

Who is going to distinguish between a single mother who needs our assistance because her husband died in a tragic accident and a single mother who needs our assistance because she can't keep her legs closed? How do you write THAT law without empowering government even more than it already is?

Who decides which of these entitlement programs are worthy and which are not? As far as I can tell, the people railing against entitlement programs are only complaining about the ones THEY don't use or the ones that THEY don't think are important. THEY have jobs, so they think unemployment benefits should be curtailed or eliminated. THEY aren't a widowed mother, so they think welfare should be cut back or eliminated.

There's not a good solution to that. The solution is absolutely NOT doing away with welfare and entitlement programs.

And of course this again completely misses the fact that welfare accounts for a very small portion of our national expenses. There could be far more valuable cost-saving cuts in other areas (like defense), but nobody wants to touch that (for a multitude of reasons).
 

superpunk

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,003
Reaction score
0
I'm all for offing the elderly.

They really serve no purpose, and just slow everyone else off.

Plus, the money their heirs would get from their life insurance would help boost the economy.

Obama Death-Camps.
 
C

Cr122

Guest
Doesn't make up enough of our national expense to really matter tbh.

It's also a necessary thing, however it does need reform. For example, I have two neighbors - one is an elderly couple who could really use assistance from the government. The husband is seriously disabled and gets disability from the government, but it's not enough. His elderly wife works six days a week so they can make ends meet, but they can't get any welfare money from the govt. OTOH, another neighbor is a bumass woman with a few kids who is completely paid for by the state, she has absolutely no intentions of working or lifting a finger to support herself or her children.

We need these programs, we just need to find ways to administer them better.

Good post, sp.
 
Messages
10,636
Reaction score
0
How about stop sending billions to countries that can't stand us. ?


Im conflicted. On one hand its great that we care, and can at times just press L2 and drop some shit on a castle. But on the other hand that shit over there is so messy and our presence there is just gold for brainwashing and propaganda so part of me just wants to stay here and mind our own business.

We cant just go over there and extract all the innocent women and children.

That is my strong stance on that issue.
 
Last edited:

superpunk

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,003
Reaction score
0
Im conflicted. On one hand its great that we care, and can at times just press L2 and drop some shit on a castle. But on the other hand that shit over there is so messy and our presence there is just gold the brainwashing and propaganda so part of me just wants to stay here and mind our own business.

We cant just go over there and extract all the innocent women and children.

That is my strong stance on that issue.

I'm intrigued.
 

Sheik

All-Pro
Messages
24,809
Reaction score
5
I know a guy that could fix this Country and answer all these questions.

Find him a room big enough to fit all these politicians into and make sure there's a lock on the door. It'll get done.
 

dbair1967

Administrator
Messages
55,013
Reaction score
6,150
How about stop sending billions to countries that can't stand us. ?

How about reforming or abolishing welfare and all of the entitlement programs?

How about doing something about ILLEGAL immigration instead of putting a fucking bandaid on it for votes. ?

Add drill here/drill now to complete this wish list
 

Plymkr

2
Messages
2,126
Reaction score
0
And who is going to be the decider of who is worthy and who is not?

Who is going to distinguish between a single mother who needs our assistance because her husband died in a tragic accident and a single mother who needs our assistance because she can't keep her legs closed? How do you write THAT law without empowering government even more than it already is?

Who decides which of these entitlement programs are worthy and which are not? As far as I can tell, the people railing against entitlement programs are only complaining about the ones THEY don't use or the ones that THEY don't think are important. THEY have jobs, so they think unemployment benefits should be curtailed or eliminated. THEY aren't a widowed mother, so they think welfare should be cut back or eliminated.

There's not a good solution to that. The solution is absolutely NOT doing away with welfare and entitlement programs.

And of course this again completely misses the fact that welfare accounts for a very small portion of our national expenses. There could be far more valuable cost-saving cuts in other areas (like defense), but nobody wants to touch that (for a multitude of reasons).

If you could figure that one out. You would hold the key to it all. I don't know how you do. What I do know is the crackhead who just popped another future felon, or the assfucks that have two escalades, big screen and live in a HUD apt. Go after those fuckers.

Hell, let's just do this. Like the government does with laws that come about because one fuckhead ruins for everyone else. Like, can't get beer after the 2nd period in hockey because some drunk fuckhead started shit.

Run welfare and entitlements like that. They know were some of the fraud is, they just don't give a shit.

Not everyone is supposed to succeed, not everyone can be saved. It's called life, and it sucks sometimes, so get a fucking helmet.

Add drill here/drill now to complete this wish list

lol..No, cant do that now. Otherwise a lot more folk wouldn't need assistance and people would be spending money again because Fuel would be CHEAP..

Kind of fucks up the Big Brother Govts plans.
 

superpunk

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,003
Reaction score
0
If you could figure that one out. You would hold the key to it all. I don't know how you do. What I do know is the crackhead who just popped another future felon, or the assfucks that have two escalades, big screen and live in a HUD apt. Go after those fuckers.

Hell, let's just do this. Like the government does with laws that come about because one fuckhead ruins for everyone else. Like, can't get beer after the 2nd period in hockey because some drunk fuckhead started shit.

Run welfare and entitlements like that. They know were some of the fraud is, they just don't give a shit.

Not everyone is supposed to succeed, not everyone can be saved. It's called life, and it sucks sometimes, so get a fucking helmet.

Obviously there isn't a real good answer. But I was just trying to illustrate that the answer is not getting rid of these programs altogether. And the portions you are talking about - people who are gaming the system - represent such an incredibly small portion of our expense as a nation that they aren't even worth worrying about when we have far bigger trimming we could do in other areas of the budget.

They make a convenient talking point because everyone hates poor crackheads who are living off the system, but fixing that would not help the budget in any significant way.
 

Plymkr

2
Messages
2,126
Reaction score
0
Obviously there isn't a real good answer. But I was just trying to illustrate that the answer is not getting rid of these programs altogether. And the portions you are talking about - people who are gaming the system - represent such an incredibly small portion of our expense as a nation that they aren't even worth worrying about when we have far bigger trimming we could do in other areas of the budget.

They make a convenient talking point because everyone hates poor crackheads who are living off the system, but fixing that would not help the budget in any significant way.

I don't care if it is two cents of stealing from taxpayers, it is still two cents. And, you don't have any data to back up that it is "only a small portion". Nobody knows. They could find out, they just don't care. Hell, it ain't their money, why would they?
 
Top Bottom