NYG - The team is turning on Eli

SixisBetter

Anywhere on the line.
From what I saw last night, the Eagles were harassing Eli pretty well. Looked like the Giants had called some plays to neutralize that somewhat, but to me Eli was off target and frankly there were some dropped passes.
If it wasn't for Barkley, they wouldn't have had much offense at all.
I couldn't say if the team turned on him, but that was one unhappy crowd.
Didn't help that the Philly offense was murdering the Giants secondary and the pass rush wasn't great either. To be fair, there were some uncomfortable times for Wentz, but I only remember 1 sack.
 

dbair1967

Administrator
As awful as the Giants are, they did manage to beat the team we just lost to for their only win, in Houston.

They scored 27 pts, had more yds rushing and total yards than we did and more sacks on Watson (just like the other teams they've played before us)
 

G-men4ver

Spectator
I have been one of the biggest Eli defenders the past 5 yrs because I always felt that it was more the OLs fault that he was unable to win games for us & only had 1 playoff app in the past 6yrs & that was due more to our D being #2 in 2016. We finally got rid of one of the worst players to ever play the LT position in not only Giants history but NFL history, in Flowers. Our entire OL is revamped from last yr.

We have a healthy OBJ back, we finally have a top tier RB in SB & yet we are only putting up 16ppg? Yes, our Ol is still not good, but I believe it's better than the OLs of the past 5yrs. 80% of OLs in the NFL are either bad, mediocre, above, decent or good. There are only 2-3 OLs that can be considered great. So Eli is not the only QB with a bad OL. DLs have faster, more athletic & stronger players so they will almost always have an edge on the OL imo. Eli is a relic of the classic pocket passer era of which is a dying breed.

Once Brady, Brees, Eli, big Ben & Rivers hang em up, the era of classic pocket passers is over. In this day & age of rules vastly favoring the O, & fast athletic DLmen, you have to have a QB that is athletic, mobile & can buy you an extra second or 2 with his legs & if the play isn't there, get the 1st down with your legs. Eli has never been able to do this even when he was young, he didn't inherit his father's mobility/athleticism unfortunately. Now in his 30s, even less. Opposing Ds never have to game plan for Eli beating them with his legs, they don't have to assign a spy on him. That makes it easier for DCs to game plan against our O.

QBs like AR & Cam are a nightmare for DCs to game plan against due to their duo threat of being able to beat you with both their arms & legs. After last night's game, I have to admit Eli is shot, he is just done as a legit NFL caliber starting QB that can move a team down the field & win you a game with 2 min left on the clock. He would need the Cowboys OL to do it & we don't have that.

What I hope the Giants do is tell him he will start the next 2 games before the bye vs Atl & the Skins & then they are gonna see what Lauetta can do in the remaining 8 games. I believe that Lauetta will at least be able to move the chains both due to his accurate passing & his ability to evade pressure with his mobility. It would be an 8 game audition for the job as the starting QB in 2019. If he excels & helps us win a few games in the 2nd half while putting up 24-27+, then great, we don't have to worry bout a QB in 2019 & can focus on improving the OL which I believe , along with QB, is what is preventing us from being a contender.

We fix the OL issues next yr & SB can really tear it up on the ground cuz right now he is having to get almost all his yds on his own. Last night he got 229 all purpose yds & a TD & we still lose by 21? No, that's on the OL & QB, our 2 biggest weakness. Let me clarify that our left side of the OL with Solder/Hernandez is fine, it's from center, RG/RT that we need to fix in the draft next yr & 2020. We fix that OL & the next QB we get will have a great O to lead with young offensive weapons like SB/OBJ/Shep/Engram to throw to/hand off to.

For the past few yrs, we've been the laughingstock of the NFL & I know fans of the Skins/Cowboys/Eagles are ragging on us but give us 2 yrs to fix the right side of the OL & a new QB & I feel we will be a legit SB contender by 2020.
 
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Scot

Quality Starter
The team is turning on Eli

I had the game on in the background as I was working so I didn’t see much

But it seemed like every time I looked up that bastard SQ was breaking off a decent run and getting the first down

It’s gonna suck having to defend him for the next 5 years till they run the wheels off the kid
 

G-men4ver

Spectator
Got through the first experience with him, very little problem out of him.
Still got 108 all purpose yds vs Dallas. He's had over 100+purpose yds in all 6 games to go with 6TDs. 1 more 100yd game vs Atl & he will tie the NFL rookie record of 7 straight 100+yd games in 1st 7 starts.

On pace to rush for 1138yds - 5.2 ypc, have 99 rec for 985yds & 16 combined rush/rec TDs & 2123 all purpose yds.
 

Doomsday

High Plains Drifter
Still got 108 all purpose yds vs Dallas. He's had over 100+purpose yds in all 6 games to go with 6TDs. 1 more 100yd game vs Atl & he will tie the NFL rookie record of 7 straight 100+yd games in 1st 7 starts.

On pace to rush for 1138yds - 5.2 ypc, have 99 rec for 985yds & 16 combined rush/rec TDs & 2123 all purpose yds.
Nothing wrong with the kid, but we're not exactly shaking in our cleats over him. Like Scot seemed to be trying to say.

There's a hot rookie RB every year. They don't all stay hot and their shelf life is short. So far we've had very little problem out of him.
 

G-men4ver

Spectator
That he's #2 rusher behind Zeke who has the way superior OL is very impressive.

Zeke-480yds on 93att 5.2ypc 2 TDs rush. 3 runs of 20+ 96ypg 2 fum 24 1st dns
SB -438yds on 84att 5.2ypc 4 TDs rush. 7 runs of 20+ 73ypg 0 fum 19 1st dns
 

SixisBetter

Anywhere on the line.
Nothing wrong with the kid, but we're not exactly shaking in our cleats over him. Like Scot seemed to be trying to say.

There's a hot rookie RB every year. They don't all stay hot and their shelf life is short. So far we've had very little problem out of him.
Yeah, I like the kid, very dangerous in the open field. Pretty sure some of those Philly defenders had to go find their shoes after a couple of plays.
Remains to be seen how big a threat he'll be going forward.
As you say, some of these guys flame out.
 

Doomsday

High Plains Drifter
Zeke who has the way superior OL
That's quite exaggerated. Dallas' OL had its day. Right now it's not any better than the average OL. Injuries, deadly illness and better d-lineman league-wide have knocked them down off their 2016 pedestal by a long way. We can't blow holes in 9 man boxes like we used to could. We cant pass block like we used to could. Losing Frederick was a huge blow and although his replacement has been servicable, it's still a big dropoff from the Real Deal in many respects.

You seem to be reacting like I was saying your boy sucks. I've said nothing of the kind and don't think so either. I'm merely pointing out he's nothing to be scared of "for the next 5 years" like Scot was hyping. And so far we've had very little problem out of him.
 

G-men4ver

Spectator
He's only played 1 game vs Dallas & that was his 2nd pro game. Compared to our OL, yours is superior despite the things you mentioned. Our #2 pick, Hernandez is the only one on our OL that has played well so far, even Solder, our over priced new LT has been playing like crap lately. Eagles DL owned us most of the night. Main reason they won. Game is won/lost in the trenches.
 

Doomsday

High Plains Drifter
He's only played 1 game vs Dallas & that was his 2nd pro game.
Nobody said otherwise and it makes no dent in what I said. So far we've had very little problem out of him.
Compared to our OL, yours is superior despite the things you mentioned.
You've backpedaled from your original, vastly exaggerated statement. Good job. Now you're merely comparing the number of 1st round picks or whatever. I don't know, I'm not even reading it at this point. It makes no difference. The NY o-line is serviceable, just like about every other one in the league including Dallas.

Now, is the team turning on Eli or no?
 

G-men4ver

Spectator
I would say that some players in the locker room might be & it's causing a rift in the team between players that are still loyal to Eli & those that aren't. Our OL is "serviceable" for a mobile athletic QB, which Eli has never been even when young. Defenses don't have to worry bout us running the RPO, they don't have to worry bout Eli taking off & running for a 1st when a play breaks down. That is very limiting to an O as far as moving the chains & giving the D a good rest. At one point this O went 15 straight 3rd downs w/o converting between the Car/Philly games. That has got to piss off the D when they have to get back on the field after just 3 min or less. Only way he plays all yr is if we can reel off 3-4 straight wins vs Atl/Wash/SF/TB to get to 5-5 & get back in the playoff hunt. We just thru with playing the toughest part of our schedule & Atl is 1-4, Skins are beatable as are SF/TB, so who knows. But if we are 2-6 at the bye, I would like to see the Giants bring in Lauletta for the final 8 games & audition for the starting job as our future QB. If he plays great & helps this team even go 4-4 the rest of the way, great, we have our QB, now we can look to draft a stud OLman #1 next yr & another one in rd 2. If he stinks it up, then we know what we have to draft in 19'. QB #1, stud OLman #2. Another strong draft in 2020 to shore up both lines & I really think we can be a serious playoff contender in 2020.
 

Doomsday

High Plains Drifter
I would say that some players in the locker room might be & it's causing a rift in the team between players that are still loyal to Eli & those that aren't. Our OL is "serviceable" for a mobile athletic QB, which Eli has never been even when young. Defenses don't have to worry bout us running the RPO, they don't have to worry bout Eli taking off & running for a 1st when a play breaks down..
NFL Live did an analysis of o-line play based on metrics derived from chips in players' shoulder pads and the results were quite illuminating. The Giants graded out as one if the top pass protecting lines in the league. A "win" is if they hold their blocks for 2.5 seconds. Measured by when the defender gets a shoulder past. Interestingly your line is blocking well for Eli, he's just taking way too long to decide where to send it then when he does it's often off target.

You have one of the best pass blocking lines in the league. You have a pocket passer quarterback who for whatever reason isn't getting the ball out like he used to. Age? Too complex of an offense? Brain fog? Who knows.

The RPO shit is a flash in the pan, pocket passing is where it's at in the passing game. Might ask Tom Brady and Big Ben or Rodgers about that. When the RPO crap starts winning Super Bowls, I might start to take it seriously. Wentz is a good example. He is a natural pocket passer who can also run. But the more RPO the Eagles do, the less effective their passing game has been.
 

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