REAL football on ESPN right now.
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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    REAL football on ESPN right now.

    For those who want to watch real football, there's Navy running the wing-T offense, vs. Virginia.

    Wing-T goes all the way back to the 40s. You won't see many passes.

    21-7 Navy right before half, Navy with over 200 yards rushing already and ate most of the 1st half game clock.

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    WKG ThoughtExperiment's Avatar
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    I freaking love service academy football.

    In any event, you've accomplished the near impossible......to have a thread closed/locked on DCU.

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    I freaking love service academy football.
    Navy practiced in full pads the last 2 weeks getting ready for this bowl game and it shows. Just thumping them.

    We ran the split-T in my school days. Just loved it, it was smash mouth and nothing but smash mouth.

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    Okay, I should know this because my grandpa was a football coach and when I was a little kid he told me he thought Clark Shaunessey's book on the Wing-T was genius. But isn't what they're running more like the wishbone with the halfbacks up in a wingback position? Or is that basically the same thing. I thought what Gus Malzahn does at Auburn is more Wing-T-ish. (I love that he's shown how it can work in today's "modern" game also.)

    One thing I didn't realize also... Did you use a lot of option like they do in the Wing T?

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    isn't what they're running more like the wishbone with the halfbacks up in a wingback position? Or is that basically the same thing.
    It is the same thing. Here's a pretty basic wing-T set, mostly what we saw from Navy today except the split end was in tight more often:



    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    Did you use a lot of option like they do in the Wing T?
    Definitely. The split-T differs from the wing-T because there's no wingbacks, there's 2 HBs lined up on either side of the FB. And it's called "split" T because the splits - the space between the linemen - vary by situation and by play. We line up in tight splits on goal line and short yardage situations, and wider splits the rest of the way depending on what we wanted you to do in response. We'd also line up tight when we wanted just a straight pitchout, no QB option for that one. Fooled 'em every time, but typically we'd only do that once per game, and typically late when we were sure most teams' film had run out! Here's a typical split-T set:



    If the opponent didn't match our splits, they were really in for some shit. We'd fuck 'em up real bad. We'd even fuck 'em up if they did match the splits. This offense was really a nightmare in its day.

    Disadvantage of both of these is any time you're in slick or muddy conditions, you're basically dead because this is ALL about timing. And today's upfield pressure DL play means you really can't run the split-T and have any success at all. These monster defensive linemen of today would just shoot those big gaps and disrupt the timing of the play at the very least, and blow it totally up at the worst.

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    Good post Dooms... Even though for some reason the attachments didn't work?

    But... I love how some people think those offenses from back then had about four running plays and that was it, that it was so primitive. But what they don't know is all the subtle variations in blocking schemes, counter moves, etc that were just enough to throw a defense off.

    I still love watching Georgia Tech play and do this. It's basically an old wishbone (or flexbone, like Navy) but it's not the same triple option play over and over. There are all kinds of different wrinkles to make defenses hesitate for just that half-step you need. And it still works today.

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    Even though for some reason the attachments didn't work?
    You might have to click on them. I don't know offhand what browser you're using.
    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    But... I love how some people think those offenses from back then had about four running plays and that was it, that it was so primitive. But what they don't know is all the subtle variations in blocking schemes, counter moves, etc that were just enough to throw a defense off.

    I still love watching Georgia Tech play and do this. It's basically an old wishbone (or flexbone, like Navy) but it's not the same triple option play over and over. There are all kinds of different wrinkles to make defenses hesitate for just that half-step you need. And it still works today.
    Navy runs the wing-T and so does Army. The Amarillo High School Golden Sandstorm does too, as does the Amarillo Tascosa Rebels. (Two of my local HS teams.)

    I really enjoyed playing in the split-T for the three years that I did. It didn't matter that the opponent pretty much knows what's coming, he had no way to know how it was coming. And there were myriads of ways to attack a defense.

    First, we would probe. Run plays like '50 pop' to test the middle. And if we found weakness there we would by god keep running that same play over and over until you stopped it more than once - you had to show that you could stop it. Then we would move on to another area of your line, probing and finding another weakness, and feed you a steady diet of that play until you demonstrated you could stop it.

    Penalties kill this offense though, you really really have to be highly disciplined. You simply cannot afford any penalties and if you were 'that guy' you would be watching from the sidelines on game day. You would be 'crabbing' through practice the day after a game, you would be running wind sprints all during practice Monday. You would be running laps all during practice Tuesday. Needless to say we didn't have any penalty problems.

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    Using Firefox but when I click I get the "Invalid attachment specified" message...

    Anyway, cool that some high schools are still using this. I kind of hate that everyone in the world feels like they have to run the spread these days. Every once in a while I hear about a school in Texas or Oklahoma that runs the wishbone or similar "antiquated" offense and still wins big with it because teams have no idea how to defend them anymore.

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    Using Firefox but when I click I get the "Invalid attachment specified" message...

    Anyway, cool that some high schools are still using this. I kind of hate that everyone in the world feels like they have to run the spread these days. Every once in a while I hear about a school in Texas or Oklahoma that runs the wishbone or similar "antiquated" offense and still wins big with it because teams have no idea how to defend them anymore.
    The "upfield pressure" defensive line schemes developed by Johnson in the late 60s through his time at OSU was the death knell for these offenses, particularly the wishbone. As they melted away and a generation or two went by, nobody was left around to teach linebackers and DBs how to play against these. So now they're making a minor comeback. I've been happy to see the return of Real Football even if it's just in some colleges and high schools.

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    Using Firefox but when I click I get the "Invalid attachment specified" message...
    I removed the attachments in my post and inserted the images inline. You should be able to see them now.

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    Defense Haleyrules's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoughtExperiment View Post
    I freaking love service academy football.
    It's real and they play with passion.

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Meanwhile the Miami Hurricanes are looking badast with their black-out uniforms in the Orange Bowl right now on ESPN.

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    Draft Pick NoMoRedJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doomsday View Post
    Meanwhile the Miami Hurricanes are looking badast with their black-out uniforms in the Orange Bowl right now on ESPN.
    College color rush unis

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    Star Spangled Butt Kicker Doomsday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoMoRedJ View Post
    College color rush unis
    They're not Nike-supplied stuff though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doomsday View Post
    Meanwhile the Miami Hurricanes are looking badast with their black-out uniforms in the Orange Bowl right now on ESPN.
    They played like shit, to match those dog fucking ugly uniforms
    This needs to be the final season of Garrett & his staff. The greatest coaches on the planet should be candidates to lead the best org in sports. The days of teams blowing the Cowboys’ doors off in halftime adjustments needs to end. Time for change, new direction and a new voice
    — Ben Rogers (@BenRogers) November 20, 2017

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